ROMing and warrenty?

Not sure IDF it has been covered already, but with Tings more open stance on customizing a phone how is that affecting the warranty?

Reason being,I just received my marque and batter life is unacceptable, not "this is bad" its "there is certainly something wrong here".  I am not new to smart phones, and 7 hours on standby off a fresh reboot is outside the realm of just a short battery life.

My question is if its in the firmware, the radio, or the hardware. Being its a return any of the above could be the result.  I would like to try updating the firmware to see if that helps, but if it voids my warrenty then this bone is going back an I hope for better luck next time.

Of course, any positive or negative results will be written up, and if this solves the issues many are having then maybe this couldsave ting from some returns.

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Comments

15 comments
  • The basic stance is: replacing the bootloader, recovery, or operating system voids the warranty. The warranty is supplied by the manufacturer, not Ting, so it has nothing to do with Ting. That being said, Ting tries to help their customers, so they will likely work with you, but they do not carry the warranty.

    If you're still running stock and it's eating battery life like crazy, it's probably because of all the garbage that comes with the stock OS. I personally never run any stock systems because they are horrendously slow and the battery life is miserable. I accept burning my warranty with that though, happy to do so. Sure, that means I've spent a day or two without a working phone because I broke something, but I also tend not to give up and continue to tweak until I get it working again. It depends how much time you are willing to spend. Just make sure you go into it with your eyes wide open. Taking responsibility for your fiddling is important.

    Read about the battery life for this phone on the forums, some others seem to note similar things. This seems to be state of the stock OS. If you are not happy with that, you have two options: return the phone and get something else, or void the warranty and put a more lean OS on it. You don't have any other options (sorry, you can't have your cake an eat it too). The important thing to note is that prior to android, consumers didn't have that second option at all. I, for one, and thoroughly pleased that the second option exists. If that means I toss the warranty out the window, then by all means, I'm happy to do so. I'll be glad to give that up if it means I get control over my device and in turn enjoy a much better user experience and battery life. Not everyone is comfortable with that decision, and it's a choice everyone has to make for themselves.

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  • Well, the problem is it doesn't seem to be directly tied to the OS.  Some have the problem, others don't, thus it isn't an OS specific problem, but maybe an instillation problem.  In the end the current standby time for many users is barely over the rated talk time, that indicates a problem somewhere and not just a bloated OS.

     

    As far as warrenty goes, the only information ting would provide was that the phone was covered under their 30 day return policy, I never did get a concrete answer about what the manufacture warrrenty was.

    Bottom line, IMO this goes well beyond a bloated is, even with a bloated OS I should be able to leave my phone in my car while at work and come out to a working phone, that's not the case right now.  Heck, on standby my battery draw is near as much as the charger puts into the phone!

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  • I'm not disagreeing that the battery life is unacceptable. I quite agree with you.

    However, I disagree about the cause. I would easily believe that it is the OS and not something lower level. Just because it burns battery on standby does not absolve the OS in the least bit. A misbehaving application or system component could very easily drain the battery by running the CPU down in standby. In android, applications and system components do not have any obligations to obey any notices about being active versus in standby (in fact, there is no such thing as standby mode), it's just the screen being off. Any process can still churn away in the background and use as much power (or more, if it so desired) despite not actively running. If you think it's an initialization problem, then I suggest you factory wipe the phone and try again. If that doesn't solve it, you have a decision to make.

    Regarding the warranty, there is a manufacturer warranty. It's usually 90 days or so for defects in new devices. They will send a replacement one. Check the documents that came with the phone. I don't know manufacturer's policy on refurbished devices. Ting's return policy is a separate concept on top of that, and the reason they aren't saying anything definitive is because there isn't a concrete return policy or warranty offered by them.

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  • Ryan,

     

    Totally agree a rogue application could cause battery drain, some more info might help and I should have included it earlier.

    Using Gsam battery monitor the radio has used roughly 90% of all battery consumed, this was after a reset with Gsam as the only app installed.  I also find it had to believe that LG or Sprint would put out a phone with software installed that would cause the phone to die while the owner got a good nights sleep.

    As far as the warranty goes, the phone came with no paperwork and I have specifically asked ting about the warrrenty coverage and the response was the phone was only covered under the 30 days.

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  • Some info from Gsam.

    71% battery consumed in 5 hours and 18 minutes.

    The screen accounts for 5%

    App usage (includes kernel) 7.8%

    Held Awake 10%%

    Phone Radio 76.1%

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  • Grr, no ability to edit...

    Last note then, the phone is physically warm near the top.  I don't mean hot, I don't mean room temp, and not just 'not cold', but the phone is, well, warm, and only at the top 1/3rd of the phone.

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  • Hey all,

    One thing I want to make sure is clear within the overall context here is that, being a refurbished phone, the warranty is only good for 30 days, and thus once those 30 days pass, the question of voiding the warranty becomes moot.

    Additionally, anyone having a problem with the battery life is free to pursue a third option - contacting us directly and seeing if we can troubleshoot the issue with you.

    Of course you are free to root and use a variant OS as you want, however, any phone coming back to us within those 30 days that is rooted and/or has that variant (meaning simply non-Sprint) OS on it will not be eligible - wink wink.

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  • You could try to narrow it down too.  The radio may control wifi, cell calling, and cell data.  As a test, turn off wifi and see if the problem goes away.  If now turn off mobile data.  it coud be that you have a very weak mobile data in the area and every time it loses signal it runs a new search and eatch battery.  Low signal will typically eat battery faster.  Roaming can eat battery as well as the providers want you off of roam as fast as possible.  The phone will always be trying for a non-roam tower using the PRL as a reference.  On that note try a PRL update too.

    Always give Ting a chance to make you happy.  They rarely fail.

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  • Rob,

    Thanks for the info, exactly the answer.

     

    Now, for an update.

    Last night I charged the phone and did a factory reset (2nd one).  Currently at 20 hours since then with 82% battery remaining!  The OS is clean, WiFi and background Data off, and that's it, oh and synced contacts over WiFi and one app installed.  In this time on 15 minute call was made and battery percentage was checked maybe 10 times, otherwise no usage.

    In that time the radio has consumed 87% of the power used, "phone" 7% and apps 4%.  Signal strength has been moderate for this period, neither high or excessive low.

    This is a dramatic turn around, previously, even on a fresh reset battery usage much higher.

    I will test with background data on, and with WiFi on at a later time.

     

    Keith,, no complaints with ting so far, just didn't want anybody to put more effort into it other than a few forum posts untill more testing was done.  As of right now the phone is certainly acceptable and seems to be functioning in a way I would consider normal, time will tell if it stays that way.

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  • Factory reset for the win!

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  • Haha, I wish.  Looks like this one needs to go back.  That same day I finally got bored of my dumb smartphone and turning on WiFi and downloading some apps took out 60% of the battery in 30 minutes.  Today, made it to 60% in 24 hours (sleep and work) but using the phone killed 50% of the battery in an hour and a half, probably 10% of that time was actual usage.  Both times the top of the phone got warm to the touch.

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  • Sounds to me like wifi is the issue. Is this a clean wifi network? Is it a private wifi network with only your phone on it? Is the wifi on a private network or is the wifi router acting as a network bridge to the LAN on the same subnet? Are there lots of access points that show up on wifi list? If you shift locations elsewhere, do you notice different behavior?

    It's rather unusual for wifi chips to be bad, it sounds much more like something is hammering away at the phone when it's connected to wifi such that the radio and processor are being pegged, causing it to heat up and eat battery. I have a sneaking suspicion that there is nothing wrong with the phone itself but more an issue with the environment it's in.

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  • The WiFi is my home WiFi, a AT&T uverse router.  Router is private.  This router is the same on that serves my wife's transform (WiFi always on), a nexus 7, and a variety of other devices, none of which have previously had a problem.  Unfortunately I have not accessed any other access points to see if it happens onoother access points.

    Last night and today I had WiFi on with no drain, then again the phone was set to sleep WiFi.  I am setting WiFi to never sleep to see what happens.

    BTW thanks for all the help, I didn't intend for this thread to turn so much into another battery thread.

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  • Well, an update.  After a pleasurable talk with Ting they are sending me a new phone.  I think it was Deli I spoke with and he was a joy in this case.  He did express that he feels it is likely not a problem with the phone, both the short battery life and the heating while charging, but yet he was happy to send me a new phone to try and do what he can.

    As for battery life.  I have determined that being connected to my WiFi is a significant drain on battery, with Power Tutor showing regular peaks to 600ma draws on the WiFi circuit, regular as in multiple times per second.  However, today with WiFi off the phone lasted 16 hours.  Of that time CPU spy showed the phone was in deep sleep for 95% of that time, and Gsam Battery monitor showed 90% of the draw was from the radio, 5% for the one call to ting, and the other 5% was the screen, kernel and apps were virtually no draw.

    I just need a phone that can make it one day with minor usage, but right now I can make it a day, or use the phone with what appears to be a 10:1 reduction in standby time vs run time.  Even my Touch Pro 2 and its horrible battery life could make it one day with minor use, two with a custom ROM.

    Time will tell if the replacement works out, but if its the same then I will just root and flash to see what can be done.  If anything helps I'll write it up for the ting army and hopefully it can help others.

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  • Eli, not Deli thank you auto-correct. 

    On that note: http://fyouautocorrect.com/

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